Source: What Bitcoin Did
Compiled by: Felix, PANews
Recently, Strategy founder and executive chairman Michael Saylor appeared on the What Bitcoin Did podcast, engaging in an in-depth conversation with host Danny Knowles.
In the interview, Saylor pointed out that Bitcoin’s true victory is not in short-term price movements, but in historic fundamental breakthroughs, from restoring insurance, adopting fair value accounting standards, to full acceptance by the banking credit system. He also shared Strategy’s grand vision of building “digital credit” and responded to external doubts about DAT company. Below are the key highlights.
Multiple breakthroughs in fundamentals, institutional adoption is the biggest progress
Danny: Bitcoin is now 17 years old. Last year was somewhat disappointing for Bitcoin, not what I expected, and the same goes for companies issuing Bitcoin products, especially in the second half of the year, which was really tough. Did you anticipate 2025 to be like this?
Saylor: I don’t think this was a disappointing year. The only disappointment was the price at the end of the year. Actually, in the first week of the last quarter (October), Bitcoin hit a new all-time high. The entire community’s memory is very short, mainly focusing on what happened in the past five days. By 2024, about 30 to 60 companies will hold Bitcoin on their balance sheets, and by the end of 2025, this number will reach around 200. So, in my view, the fundamentals look quite good. Bitcoin hit a new high, adding about 100 new companies holding Bitcoin on their balance sheets.
If we list everything that happened in 2025, we will see that we reached historic highs.
First, insurance was restored in 2025. When purchasing Bitcoin in 2020, the insurance company canceled our policy. We lost insurance coverage. For four years, I had to insure the company. The company once had assets of 20 billion, 30 billion, 40 billion dollars, but couldn’t afford a 40 million dollar policy. If I hadn’t used my personal assets to insure the company, this strategy wouldn’t exist.
Second, profitability was restored in 2025. We adopted fair value accounting, and now the company can finally make money. We have always faced the issue of corporate minimum tax. Does a publicly listed company holding Bitcoin need to pay unrealized capital gains tax? This question received positive guidance from the government in 2025, and was resolved. So, we were not impacted by unrealized capital gains tax.
Then, Bitcoin was officially recognized by the government as the world’s primary and largest digital commodity in 2025. Subsequently, Bitcoin’s price reached a new all-time high. At the beginning of the year, borrowing against Bitcoin worth one billion dollars could get less than five cents in loans. But by the end of the year, most major US banks started issuing loans collateralized by IBIT, with about a quarter of banks announcing plans to lend against BTC. By early 2026, JPMorgan and Morgan Stanley were discussing buying, selling, and handling Bitcoin.
The Treasury Department also issued positive guidance on including crypto assets in bank balance sheets. The chairs of the US CFTC and SEC also support Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies. Additionally, the commercialization of Bitcoin derivatives markets on the Chicago Mercantile Exchange (CME) was witnessed. You also saw physical creation and redemption mechanisms, where you can exchange Bitcoin worth 1 million USD for 1 million USD IBIT, and vice versa. Exchanging 1 million USD worth of IBIT for 1 million USD Bitcoin is tax-free.
Therefore, if I list all the fundamental elements needed for asset commercialization, globalization, and institutionalization, then in 2025, everything you want has been achieved. And you even witnessed a new high, just not on the last day of the year.
Short-term price prediction is meaningless; the industry is moving in the right direction
Danny: The fundamentals you mentioned are all positive factors for Bitcoin. I completely agree. But the current price is lower than last year. I don’t know if this is a self-fulfilling prophecy, because people believe the four-year cycle is real, so they sell Bitcoin. I think the four-year cycle has ended. What do you think 2026 will bring?
Saylor: I think trying to predict market movements within 100 days is futile. Like I said, Bitcoin hit a new high 95 days ago, and you’re complaining about price volatility. Obsessing over short-term events is wrong; Bitcoin’s core idea is that you should have a lower time preference.
Looking back over the past ten thousand years of ideological movements, those believed to be dedicated to doing something, their efforts take ten years. By the way, many people have spent ten years doing something but still haven’t succeeded; they then spend another ten or twenty years to finally succeed. If your goal is to commercialize Bitcoin, you shouldn’t analyze or evaluate your success on a 10-week or even 10-month basis. What’s the point of assessing the price trend in 2026?
If you evaluate Bitcoin’s performance using a four-year moving average, you’ll see a quite bullish trend. I believe 2026 will be a remarkable year for Bitcoin, but you shouldn’t try to predict the price 90 or 180 days ahead. The industry is moving in the right direction. The network is also heading in the right direction, and for those with keen eyes, the past 90 days are just an opportunity to buy more Bitcoin.
Bitcoin is the universal capital of the digital age; treasury companies are far from saturated
Danny: I am also very optimistic about Bitcoin’s development in 2026. What surprised me about 2025 is the emergence of so many treasury companies. How do you view those companies still using the simple strategy of “selling stocks, buying Bitcoin”?
Saylor: People all over the world can include Bitcoin as part of their investment, but not everyone can own as much Bitcoin as I do. But I wouldn’t doubt anyone buying Bitcoin. Every family, every company can buy Bitcoin. Loss-making companies might improve their balance sheets by holding Bitcoin; profitable companies can amplify returns. Suppose a company loses 10 million dollars annually, holds 1 billion dollars worth of Bitcoin on its balance sheet, and gains 30 million dollars in capital gains on its balance sheet, then what is the real criticism of this company?
Criticizing a company that buys Bitcoin is misguided. The criticism shouldn’t be about buying Bitcoin, but about their continuous losses. Why not focus criticism on companies that are losing money and not holding Bitcoin?
Danny: I don’t mean to criticize any company, just doubt whether the market can accommodate over 200 companies buying Bitcoin.
Saylor: I don’t understand why you say that; it’s like doubting whether the market can accommodate 200 people buying Bitcoin. There are 400 million companies worldwide. You think only 10 can buy Bitcoin? Why can’t all 400 million companies buy Bitcoin? Don’t they do other things? I think you’re trying to criticize a rational company, which is a bit silly. What do you want them to buy instead of Bitcoin? What do you want to promote as a substitute for Bitcoin? Holding Bitcoin is like a factory holding electrical infrastructure; it’s a productivity tool, not just a speculative asset. Electricity is universal capital that can power any machine; Bitcoin is the universal capital of the digital age.
Danny: My concern is that some companies might see this as a money-making opportunity rather than genuinely wanting to develop interesting things.
Saylor: That’s also my general dissatisfaction with the Bitcoin community: they prefer to fight among themselves, criticize those who buy or support Bitcoin in different ways. They spend so much time criticizing other Bitcoin holders and companies, but the fact is, 99% of Bitcoin enthusiasts share your views, only 1% differ.
So, rather than criticizing rational companies, it’s better to reflect on ourselves. The issue isn’t about how many companies buy Bitcoin, or how big the market space is. What I want to ask is, how much scale can the current market sustain for these purely financial companies, especially considering this question itself is somewhat offensive. The problem is, you define them as purely financial companies, but they are not. Danny, what offends me is that you use this label to define what I am now and what I will always be. Your stance really offends me. Well, let me rephrase. How many companies are there on Earth? 400 million. How much space is there for companies? 400 million. So why worry about only 200?
Danny: Okay, let’s skip this topic, because I really didn’t mean to offend. Now many companies’ mNAV is below 1, and obviously, Strategy also experienced a similar downturn in 2022. Do you think they can easily return to a positive market cap ratio? Or will they face some resistance?
Saylor: I think this is just a shortsighted view; the purpose of a company is to create value, so the company’s value should be based on its operations. If I have a company in Japan, I can sell credit instruments with a 6% yield, while other credit markets only yield 2%. How much is this company worth? Isn’t it Japan’s most valuable company? So my point is, whatever a company does, its value depends on its own fundamentals. The key is what they do. We choose to create digital credit.
Do you know how big the space for digital credit development is? Do you know how many companies issue preferred credit? How many issue corporate credit? Do you think the market will be saturated? Absolutely not. If you create a Bitcoin-backed derivative business, in theory, it can outperform traditional derivatives. If you create a Bitcoin-backed exchange, it can be better than ordinary exchanges, and you can even create an insurance company. How many insurance companies worldwide use Bitcoin as collateral or capital? Not a single one. This industry is enormous.
And there’s an important legal point: if you have an operating company, your equity value depends not only on what you’re doing with your capital now but also on what you might do. Just because I haven’t done it doesn’t mean I can’t.
Strategy is digital credit, borrowing USD reserves to enhance company reputation
Danny: You just said you would never be interested in becoming a bank, or maybe you wouldn’t be interested. Many people are speculating about your strategic direction. Why not?
Saylor: Because our business can theoretically expand almost infinitely. We have a product called STRC deferred digital credit line. What is a perfect product? A publicly traded product with a 10% dividend yield and a V value of 1 or 2. If we can capture 10% of the government bond credit market, that’s 10 trillion USD. So, the total potential market size of my product is 10 trillion USD. Who wants it? Everyone does. Who wants a bank account that can pay bills? What if it drops to zero?
We think our business philosophy is simple. Bitcoin is digital capital, Strategy is digital credit. Also, the reason for not doing banking is to avoid distraction; we want to create the world’s best digital credit products. If you truly have a vision to transform the global monetary system, banking system, and credit markets, then don’t get distracted. Meanwhile, competing with your clients is the stupidest thing.
Danny: You are accumulating dollars and Bitcoin. Is this to become a liquidity pool for digital currencies, or to eliminate concerns about interest payments when investing in preferred stocks?
Saylor: The reason for building USD reserves is to enhance the company’s credibility, and to improve its image in the eyes of credit investors. The reason people buy credit is because they think Bitcoin and stocks are too volatile.
If you’re a stock investor, you want more Bitcoin, higher volatility. But if you’re a credit investor, you want assets with the highest credibility. So, if you want to be the biggest participant in the digital credit field, how do you improve your company’s credibility? Holding USD reserves can boost credibility and make your product more attractive.
Related: Will Bitcoin dropping to $80,000 break the Strategy model?
